Tune in for a powerful episode as Christian Reichert shares his journey from incarceration to freedom. Tune in as we discuss his experiences, challenges, and the transformative power of resilience. This is an episode that we had planned to record from prison. Fortunately, Christian was able to join us from the comfort of his own home.
In case you didn’t know, Christian Reichert had been serving a 23 year sentence for a non-violent cannabis offense. Christian got out almost a month ago after serving ~8 years incarcerated. While we’ve covered Christian’s story in the past, his recent release added an exciting new chapter that I couldn’t wait to explore.
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The auto-generated transcript is available below.
hello and welcome today we’ll be speaking with somebody who just got out of prison for a nonviolent cannabis offence in the state of Illinois this is the Cole memo I’m your host Cole Preston every episode is released in audio video and transcript format to find the transcript audio or video version of any episode please refer to the description of the episode that you’re listening to now within that description you can find a link that will take you to our website which will display the transcript for this episode and the platforms where you can find this episode in audio or video formats if you’re unable to locate the episode description on whichever platform you’re listening from Simply take note of the episode number and visit the co memo.com from there you can use our search functionality which is in the top right hand corner of the website you can use the search functionality to find the corresponding episode and then you’ll be able to access the audio video and transcript version of that episode you might also find any links that we reference during the episode so that you might be able to do your own research if you’re not listening to this episode of the Cole memo on patreon then you are listening to this episode later than our patrons to become a patron go to the coal memo.com patreon it’s a great way to support our show it only costs $3 a month and it allows you to get immediate access to all episodes as they release another way to support our show is by going to the Cole memo /s support that allows you to give a one-time monthly or yearly contribution of your choice that’s right you could give us a dollar once you could give us a dollar monthly which would be $122 a year and every little bit counts it does cost money to produce this show to distribute this show to buy equipment for this show and to travel for this show so if you’re able to support us financially that would be greatly appreciated but one of the best ways to support our show is absolutely free subscribe to or follow follow our show leave us a positive review from wherever you’re listening to us from favorite this episode give it a thumbs up leave a comment or post a review your engagement and support is appreciated today is March 7th [Music] 2024 hello and welcome folks in case you didn’t know in ill people are still being arrested for cannabis as evidenced by research by James Schwartz at the Jane Adams College of social work at the University of Illinois and Chicago arrests for cannabis continue predominantly in areas without cannabis dispensaries coincidentally these areas have historically shouldered the brunt of these enduring policies that we know as the War on Drugs you might be wondering why do people continue to be arrested for cannabis in Illinois a state that supposedly legalized in 2020 the short answer is that the bill which many people say legalized cannabis truly only decriminalized small amounts of cannabis cultivation of the plant and possession exceeding the small amount that is allowed still results in criminalization and in many cases incarceration that’s right in the state of Illinois people are still being incarcerated for non-violent cannabis related crimes it’s been something I’ve covered on this show for quite some time so if you’re a longtime listener or refined in cannabis policy like my friend Phil here my apologies for the recap if you’re not familiar and would like to learn more check out some of the links in the show notes where you can learn more about these issues we’ve spoken about them at length today we’re talking about a bit of a different case a case that happened before the year of 2020 I’ve been speaking to today’s guest through a secondary source for quite some time tonight is the first time I’ll officially be speaking with them tonight I’m thrilled to be speaking with our guests from the comfort of their home following their recent release from incarceration I would say it’s a positive shift from our original plan which was to connect with them while they were incarcerated I think it’s much better to be doing this from the comfort of your couch right before I have Christian say hi uh I’m going to play a small video that’ll give you a little bit of background on this case and then we’ll introduce ourselves to Christian so let’s play the video Christian rer arrested in 2016 he’s serving a 23-year sentence in Illinois for a marijuana conspiracy no violent charges no prior just a 24-year-old guy caught in the wrong place at the wrong time you might be thinking isn’t weed legal in Illinois now we’ll get to that in just a bit the craziest part is according to his mom Tina rker the former State’s attorney Mike Carr asked the judge to give him 40 years and he was given 23 years on one charge and 15 years on the other charge for intent to distribute and it was proven in court he never distributed anything his mom went on to say he was held in the Jackson County jail for 2 and 1/2 years on a $2.5 million Bond Christian made no money off of this marijuana conspiracy but as a naive young man did a childhood friend a couple of favor that he is remorseful for he has been a model inmate marijuana is now legal both medically and recreationally while the state is making millions off the sale of marijuana I believe in second chances and feel he has served a fair sentence for the small role he played in this marijuana conspiracy if you guys would like to sign the petition I will have a link all right no need to sign any more petitions Chris welcome to the show thank you thank you co uh it’s great great being on here today guys I appreciate the the opportunity absolutely dude absolutely well it’s been a while um real quick actually Phil you mind saying hi for our listeners so they know your voice oh you’re muted oh those dogs in the background hey I’m Phil what’s up Phil I got a couple here myself yep yep hopefully my cats won’t be bothering me during the stream it’s nice to know we’re surrounded by pets though that means we’re we’re surrounded by love um so anyways Christian what I was going to ask you was uh how’s it been it’s been a few few weeks now now has it been a month I don’t know uh since you got uh what’s what’s the date today 37224 so I am two days shy of being out a complete month and it’s been it’s been crazy it’s been overwhelming it’s been like just hard to like just like take it all in dude real but it’s it’s been it’s been great the transition has been great um mind you know the fact that they just kind of throw you out all right here you go here’s the Free World again you know not go figure it out on your own but we’ll leave the light on you for you you know just in case you do want to come back you know so it uh it’s definitely it’s not easy it’s it’s not a it’s not something that you because no matter how much time you have to like PR prepare and plan for your release like there’s no way like at least least that first time that you can even try to to Fathom like what’s going to happen when you walk out of those Gates you know yeah how old are you Christian I will be 32 in April gotcha so for the last eight years you’ve been incarcerated right yeah Y and Phil where do we want to start today we want to start with why you got incarcerated and then maybe talk through the whole experience that sound yeah be be a good sequence yeah cool well Christian tell us about uh getting popped for Canabis getting busted for cannabis right so uh man it it all really kind of started uh before I even got into the game um you know I’ve I’ve kind of always been you know associated with people that you know dealt with cannabis and you know it’s always just kind of been around my life growing up can I ask real quick you remember how early it got introduced to you so I was probably I was younger than probably 10 when I figured out what it was sure um so I I want to say I was probably I was probably hip around like sevenish like you know kind of started noticing the different odors between cigarettes and marijuana you know so um being around some of the adults you know I uh I started to catch on early like huh that’s that’s a weird smell like you know why is it that always smell it you know around these certain people or whatever so um yeah but the first time that I actually experimented I was probably about 11 11 years old um you know one of my dad’s or one of my buddies dads actually kind of dealt a little bit on the small level and you know as a kid you know he just was like pinching little little little nugs off and uh he ended up filling up like a little Matchbox like you know that you pull your matches out of he filled one of those up and uh brought it over one day and we were just like hell let’s let’s try it out you know so we were like sixth grade I believe you know U so yeah that was the first time I was pretty much formally introduced and experimented with it and kind of became you know not I won’t say like a fatuated but I always always did kind of show an interest in it you know at an early age you know yeah so before I asked you that you were talking about how you got kind of involved and sounded like maybe selling it okay so yeah so really I never did sell it I you know I never maybe helped a friend out you know a time couple times throughout you know like just kind of middle man and like hey can you find some if you can will you pick it up for me stuff like that you know like the normal but as far as like it being like my everyday hustle and profiting from it I never never really got into it like that you know I was just more so did it as a hobby and something that you know that I enjoyed doing but um so yeah as I as I kind of got older it it definitely started to kind of get you know become more available you know and and then more amounts became available you know I started meeting different people and stuff like that but uh particularly you know the incident that happened like so before I ever even got involved um you know I had left Illinois to try to get away from some of my old lifestyle ways you know partying and drinking and stuff like that so I I moved out to uh Montana where I was a tree trimmer in a union and was doing good you know I had kind of gotten my myself together and was living out there in one of the most beautiful states that there’s known to man and um I ended up leaving Montana and transferring to California and one day my buddy just called me up he’s like hey man he’s like I got you know I got something I would like to offer you you know and see if you’re willing to maybe consider you know doing it and he kind of gave me the details about it he’s like you know you just kind of be picking up some marijuana and you know just hauling it you know to one place to the another and you know and he told me the amount of money that he would pay me to do it I was kind of curious like man like how much could this possibly be and he never really gave me an amount you know I won’t say it was just kind of like one of them deals like you know this is one of my good friends that I want to try to help out in any way I can and so I left California and came back to Illinois where I ended up linking up with him and just within a couple days like you know I started finding out a little more information about what I’d be doing and things that I would need to have like you know I needed to have you know like a house in my name and stuff like that like all this other stuff so you know before I even before I even made my my trip you know I had got a house stuff like that you know which I seemed like it seemed seemed fair to believe that it was going to be my house you know regardless of what I was going to be keeping there but um so I rented the house and what not and then I took the trip um you know once I seen the level that it was at I was kind of like wow I think I’ve kind of bitten off more than I can chew but is it too late to kind of turn back now after I’ve kind of already been revealed what I’ve seen you know and and it really just kind of happened so quickly so you know it um I don’t know what all I can say on here that’s not I mean I’ve obviously I’ve been found guilty on everything on every kind of level but um you know I don’t know about you know some of the other some of the other legali alties but sure you know we picked up quite a bit you know and um brought it back to Illinois and made it back it’s safe and sound you know and everything was going good you know unloaded it and put it up and then that was pretty much it for me you know I got I got what I got from it and then um yeah and then one day you know chain of events kind of turned and you know my friend got robbed and you know they wanted to they wanted to try to you know get back what they had been robbed of of and it I I know you’re probably familiar with pretty much most of the story right Cole pretty well yeah so I mean you know they retaliated against some of the guys and in the process of them retaliating they end up getting into a highp speed spot a highspeed Chase with um with police office police officers and one of the guys that had was retaliating ended up shooting one of the cops in the chase and so pretty much like even though I wasn’t even around the town or in the car or anything like that it still backfired on me because of the pounds that had been robbed basically fell back on me you know that some way they had come from my location and so you know once the names once the detectives and everybody started investigating within the hours after that cop had been shot they landed on my name pretty quickly you know that I was involved with the guys that were responsible for all those other events yeah so within about probably so Sunday probably Monday not even like 24 hours after that incident happened with that cop um actually just a little bit over 24 probably like 36 hours after that it happened my door was kicked in and um I was pretty much caught with um 50 pounds of marijuana in the house where I was only charged at first with unlawful possession right and I’ll kind of like if I jump around just kind of stop me but sure um so at first it was just the unlawful possession which is a Class one felony 4 to 15 in the state of Illinois right so the four is the minimum that you can get 15 being the Max and um I was charged with that count um of unlawful possession of the of the marijuana in a different County in a totally in the county in the actual County that I got busted in was was the county that basically where most of the stuff had happened but the other County that charged me with cannabis trafficking was the county that the police officer had been shot in which I had done no I had no transactions over there in that other County right so for them to be able to pick up the Cannabis trafficking charges and charged me in that other County where the cop had been shot was kind of just unexpected it was out of leftfield you know and the class X was a 12 to 60 it was um you know 12 being in the minimum 60 being in the Max and like you had said earlier on that video you know the state had asked for 40 and after I went to sentencing the judge decided on 23 and that was just that was on the Cannabis trafficking and then the conspiracy with intent to deliver is what I received the 15 years on but now going back to the original County where I was busted for the unlawful possession they after everything was said and done in that other County they dropped my unlawful possession right and it could have been a way to where people were trying to tell me oh it’s double jeopardy like they can’t charge you with the same you know it all stems from the same event so they can’t charge you with two different marijuana crimes because it’s it’s not it’s not fair you know basically what I understood is when I was first charged with the unlawful possession had I had tried to hurry up and enter a plea that the other County would not have been able to continue with the Cannabis trafficking charge because of Double Jeopardy now a lot of lawyers very I mean obviously your good top maybe marijuana lawyers might know this this little area of gray that they don’t really speak about but if I had known that I obvously I would have jumped on the first thing smoking and hurried up and tried to get out from underneath them being able to to charge me with that other charge now a lot of times nine times out of 10 the judge has to agree for you to be able to accept a plea like if I go to the judge and say I want to plead guilty to this unlawful possession right now he has an he has an option that he can deny me I don’t have to he doesn’t have to accept my plea agreement so I was pretty much stuck for those first five months in the in the county while I was spting my charge and which they end up nullifying so they nullify it which makes it basically bring them they unfiled the charges to where they could be refiled again right and then I was picked up on the Cannabis tra trafficking charge and I was extradited over into the Carbondale at Murphysboro area where I sat for two years fighting my trial so it’s a lot of it’s a a lot of like I mean even like you said like how people are still just being arrested right now um and it’s it’s simply because they don’t you know the politicians and the lawmakers and the congressmen they’re in no hurry to try to set everybody free you know and like you said like it’s it’s still a it’s still a thing to be arrested for you know so much amount of weed it’s kind of like frowned upon like you know now looking back at it the 50 pounds I got caught with wasn’t diddly squat compared to what is you know considered a lot nowadays you know what I mean right like 50 pounds is really like it’s it does seem when you say it it seems like a lot but now that like the way the game is headed now no yeah you know the relax you know people are starting to relax about it you know and it doesn’t it’s not it’s not fit and all it’s not it’s not you know methamphetamine it’s a plant that helps millions and millions of people every day you know and 50 50 pounds like is a large quantity but like I don’t know I feel like if you’re a cannabis user that’s used for a long time you’ve gone through that experience where the first amount of weed you buys like a gram yeah then you start buying eights then you start buying ounces and then you’re the guy who’s buying like a pound and splitting it up for your friends yeah so it’s like I feel like anyone who’s used it well and gone through that experience kind of see how like hey someday you get to 50 pounds yeah does just kind of like it it’s it’s it’s it fell it just kind of fell in my lap one day you know and um but it wasn’t like and it’s not obviously 50 pounds is not personal use you know what I mean I don’t want to sound like you know I’m like dismissive about the amount that I got caught with it’s just now from 2016 to now 20 24 that’s not even consider like you know what I mean and like anything in the state of Illinois anything over 11 pounds is trafficking so I mean if you did have like just say you had two or three pounds you know for personal use that last you two or three months you know so be it you’re not going to you surely should get in too much trouble for that you know now that it is being decriminalized and hopefully there are still people though in Illinois that like you know we’ve had people get arrested for like having like just over a hundred grams you know which is like a which is like a quarter pound yeah yeah and they they’ll potentially if you’re from another state you know you can get a misdemeanor on your first defense for having like 16 grams of weed on you because you’re only allowed half the amount and you can get a felony for the second time you get caught with that so you can get a felony technically for 16 grams of weed in Illinois yeah I mean that’s insane that is to Phil’s Point really quick uh just a quick plug we’ve got an article and an episode episode 56 if you want to watch uh a person that just recently got arrested and they’re a medical patient which makes this case especially interesting because as far as I’ve been told and I’ve been concerned medical patients do not have uh possession limits at home and this person got arrested for having just a little bit over a 100 grams of cannabis um back to some points you made Christian you said four to 15 years for more than well you said for the amount you got caught with but that’s still the case today and that’s kind of the point I wanted to make today none of the actual rules that impacted you like everything that happened to you would still happen to you today if you did that again today today right trafficking I was looking at this Phil I’ve never really looked at the until I started thinking about it this trafficking how it’s worded is very interesting so bringing 2500 gram or more of marijuana into the state of Illinois brings a mandatory minimum sentence of twice the minimum sentence for the sale or manufacturer of the same weight a maximum sent it’s just so I don’t even know this this wording like you get twice the penalty for bringing it into the state and that’s what they did that’s exactly what they did to me I mean they basically they enhanced it because of the amount you know h and it’s like they knew you know that it’s why I didn’t go Federal for one because the federal the federal system obviously goes off of a point system and I didn’t have any points because I didn’t really have any I didn’t have a record you know I had a few maybe no insurance tickets maybe a couple speeding tickets or something like that but nothing nothing no all misdemeanor no felonies you know this was my first felony so that being said though it was like I couldn’t get over the amount of time I’m like I’m around guys that have literally killed people and that have less time than me you know what I mean yeah that that’s one of the questions I was gonna ask you and this that really puts it into perspective I mean you probably yeah met act like really dangerous people um and what you were doing I mean I guess if you dropped 50 lbs of cannabis on somebody’s head just right maybe you could hurt them a bit maybe I mean 50 pounds isn’t a joke you know if I have a 50 pound weight dropped on my head but that’s about the only way I can think you would really hurt anybody with cannabis yeah you know what I mean I totally agree uh to your point uh earlier I just it’s really I maybe they have these numbers somewhere else I had to go to the wayb back machine to find what I was looking for though because the page was giving me like a 404 error which I believe means is no longer available online this is just a number from March 4th of 2021 and it shows that we have sold I just saw the number 1,00 1 million6 this is for the medical cannabis program mind you uh this is just for medical cannabis patients we sold 1,624 121 grams of cannabis so like you say Christian 50 pounds I don’t know that ain’t a big deal when you have a million grams being distributed throughout the entire State through the medical program yeah you know it’s it’s okay if they do it it’s not okay if we do it you know yeah and so this might be a question that’s like not chronological but I am just curious like while you were in because I’d like to ask like what it was like to go to uh you know be incarcerated and and stuff like that but like there was a time when you in and it became legal and all these stores popped up like what was that were you like what the [ __ ] you know what’s crazy is like I had this feeling like so I was sitting in the county jail I think uh pker was elected in was it 20 what was it 2019 2018 think 2018 yeah 2018 and he legal he recreational 2019 right towards the end of 2019 right into yeah May of 2019 I think yeah and so I was actually in a very the the person that I was in was pretty was pretty dangerous um just a lot of gang affiliations a lot of um fights staff assaults you know like pretty much the the the like I guess the normal stuff in prison as you said say but uh so when it happened though and I watched it on the news I had already kind of had the feeling that Chris here was going to do it you know the fact that he is Democrat and he’s already a million multi he’s a billionaire you know I just kind of had the feeling so when he did it I wasn’t really surprised my mind kind of shifted towards like man is this going to benefit me in a way you know like am I going to you know maybe have some time reduced or or you know what I mean like now that you guys are legalizing it like how are you guys going to handle the judicial part of it and I’ll be honest like I lost hope pretty quick because it was just like you know I wasn’t hearing anything there was no static there was no chatter you know about it you know so I just kind of lost like a little bit of Hope um however I started looking at like alternative routes as far as like ways things that I could control to get me home as soon as possible you know what I mean I quit looking at it as like okay maybe I’ll get this hand out and I’ll catch a blessing and I’ll just be home one day you know I I literally like I started like just thinking like okay what schooling can I do what um like because they’ve got legal courses you know like paralegals and stuff like that I’m like what all can I do that would reward me that time well back in 2008 18 and early 2019 they weren’t giving out good time in the prisons so there was only limited like school was the only way that you were going to start to kind of earn a little bit of time off your sentence so I was like man and then the way they do the schooling is your outdate they they base it on your outdate so if you have a shorter out dat you’re going to be priority on the list to get in school if you’re a couple years out or you’ve got 20 years to do you’re on a waiting list and you’re not going to you know what I mean so you’re just kind of a Sitting Duck so you can you can still just you know work out and read and do whatever you know think things that you think you can do but as far as like getting the actual like taking the right steps in the right direction until one of those courses or do one of those classes you’re not your your time is sitting still you know so so I basically I started working um I got a job in the kitchen you know as my first job you know and um but long story short I ended up completing some programs some drug programs I started earning like just little crumbs that were kind of like chunking away at it because when I left the county I left the county in 2018 October of two 2018 um I you go through a receiving which is where our our receiving is Menard I don’t know if you’re familiar with the prisons in Illinois um we we have manard which is like for the southern region of the state that’s where we go to get our to get our ID number and then like pretty much anybody Central or up in Chicago or up north they go to Stateville which is where they go get their number so in 2018 I went and got my ID number and you pull up to this old creepy castle that you know has lifers in it that have natural life sentences and everything else and um once you’re there there’s like a very small percent chance that you’re going to stay there if you’re unless you’ve killed or done a bunch of bad things to people mainly that’s where they keep the worst of the worst um but however they did they [ __ ] me like not even 45 minutes down the road to this prison called pville and and it was just as bad I mean I had guys around me that had 80 90 100 years like that were literally like my next door neighbors and it’s just kind of like one of those eye opening experiences like you don’t really have time it’s survival of the fittest like the minute you come out of your cell you could literally cut the tension with a butter knife you know and you start to like learn how to adapt and just kind of like fake it till you make it because you know obviously I’m not in a gang I’m not you know affiliated with anybody but I do have knowledge and I know how to speak and communicate and relate to people you know what I mean yeah so and I can walk into a room and almost just get about along with just about anybody you know so uh my skills were already kind of like just you know but at the same time you can’t show weakness because you you showing that vulnerability somebody’s going to sniff it out and somebody’s GNA try to you know take advantage of you or get whatever they can get you know what I mean they’re just a lot of them you know that’s how they are they’ve been you know nothing against them they’ve just been you know kind of institutionalized and that’s the way that they they pray on the system you know but uh yeah so once I got through that part that and I only did that was the first year I was locked up so like I started witnessing a lot of stuff a lot of fights a lot of craziest like PE like officers getting punched around and stuff like that and I was just kind of like man like I learned real quick like that’s not that’s not the route I want to go you know I want to try to get so like as soon as I was eligible to put in for a transfer to a lower security prison I did you know what I mean I stayed out at like because you get in any trouble or get any tickets they’re going to deny you for your transfer you know and so as soon as I got out of there I got to a different prison and like got into school my outdate was a little shorter so I had got into school got into like you know I was working again well however fast forward um 20201 they passed a bill that rewarded inmates for working jobs basically good time so every like 90 days I was earning about 32 to 33 days off my sentence right and that was just for my job contract um a lot of times they’ll only let you do two contracts so if you’re in work and school that’s two contracts you know and or if you’re in work in a drug program and a drug program all a drug program is is like basically people that go to prison that have drug problems that want to do treatment um and for them doing that they earn credit good time off their sentence well I’ve never had a serious drug problem so I can honestly say that the reason that I joined the drug programs was not to be treated on on an addiction level but it definitely taught me and helped me Identify some of my behaviors that I didn’t identify before I took before I took those drug classes in those in the in the program so it was definitely it was beneficial Not only was it getting me home sooner but it was also teaching me things about myself that I didn’t necessarily know and yeah I mean it just basically it Bo down to that was an easier prison to be at and then the last I was I was in three different prisons the last one that I just came home from um was up in East St Louis Illinois which is I don’t know if you’ve ever if you’re familiar with Illinois that’s not a very good area what prison was it it was um Southwestern uh Illinois correctional center which which is it’s under swick but it’s that’s what it stands for Southwestern Illinois correctional center and it’s in a very poor neighborhood um right in the middle of East St Louis and it actually used to be a high school um yeah it used to be a high school back in like the 80s or 90s or something and they shut it down some people bought it and converted it into a prison and and put a fence around it basically um but kind of CRA that’s kind of crazy is that is that like a private prison then it is yeah yeah and I’ll be honest dude I did like over so allog together total time in i’ I did seven and a half right and from let’s say from 200 from October of 200 2018 I was behind the door from then all the way until January of 2023 when I say behind the door I was locked up in a Cell um you know where it was bad I mean the covid hit we were locked down 23 and a half hours a day um you’re coming out for 30 minutes a day you’re doing most likely you’re going to do 20 minutes on the phone and you’re going to take a 10-minute shower then you’re GNA go lock back up in your cell and there wasn’t air conditioning or heat right I remember you telling me that no no no air conditioning there was there was heaters they did have um the heating system because in the winter they it gets too cold but uh yeah so as if it doesn’t get too hot in the summer oh dude I would say I’d rather be too cold than too hot that yeah you can you you can always put on clothes you you can’t get you know completely undressed in there you know but but yeah so I did I the co was pretty rough but I will say you become so routined out every day you know what I mean like you’re just so ready for that 30 minutes out of your cell like it’s like you know I’m sure you guys have had animals that you know are you know caged up all day and you come home and they’re just so ready to run out run around you know what I mean like it’s that same feeling you know what I mean you’re just trapped in a cage you know all day but you know once I got to that other prison up in East St Louis um that’s where I really started like opening doors um I started uh like really knocking chunks off my my time um their their drug program that they have is basically every 90day contract that you complete you get 62 days off your sentence and then if you work a job too with which is another 30 days you’re basically knocking off 90 for 90 so if you do a year in a place like that you’re pretty much knocking off a year you know what I mean so I did that and then back in September Springfield has a thing where they can put you in for this edsc which is earn discretionary sentence credit and it is pretty much a a reward system for you staying out of trouble not getting any tickets um they can deny you for criminal history so if like you’re on like your 10th bit uh you’re probably going to get denied um however it was my first first um my first prison experience they gave me a whole year off my sentence back in September so when I first started out in 2018 after I left the county after two years um my outdate in 2018 was January of 20128 right and it didn’t start moving at all quickly you know like I said until I until right about the end um and then so back in September they they knocked the year off well January 2nd they changed another bill dating back from 2018 to 2021 giving credit for all the jobs that I had worked in those three years you know from 18 to 21 so and I had worked as a kitchen as a cook um I did a laundry Porter job for about a year and a half and then I also worked um LTS which is like in the gyms or out on the yards and stuff like that and uh so I ended up earning another year on January 2nd like that like it literally they they sent me a calculation sheet it’s just a yellow piece of paper that has your new updated outdate on it you know what I mean and it all basically stems down from from Springfield you know which is our which is our state capital but uh so and then on top of just those just those two years alone that I knocked off in six months I was still earning time for the drug program that I was in so I had I had almost eight years or uh eight months knocked off of just by participating in that so for from from January of 23 to January 24 I knocked two years and eight months off my sentence that quick and it was it was just kind of like and the craziest part about it was was I was waiting I had just got denied my appeal my appeal went on from the time that I got sentenced all the way up until November of 2023 they it took them five years to finally deny me of my appeal and the appeal we can get more into that later I don’t know how much time you guys have tonight I don’t want to sit and ramble but the appeal is a whole another that’s a whole another episode uh sure I just want say really quick I don’t know about Phil but this has all been fascinating to me and I’ve just been writing some of my questions down because I don’t want to interrupt you yeah and we got all the time we we tend to ramble we tend yeah to take the time that’s what’s great about this podcast is we take the time no [ __ ] commercials um all right but yeah so J when I when I got down I got down there in January um and from back in July I had gotten some news some really good news from the state’s attorney the new States Attorney who was elected in the office from where my old States Attorney was that convicted me right um this this uh States Attorney had contacted my family my mother and and told her you know like hey um you know you’re you know son has been selected with five other people to be resentenced through our office um he was you know selected there wasn’t a whole lot of detail about it but it it come as a shock you know I’m like okay well great you know like what’s what’s the process like what do I have to do what do you need for me so that we can get this ball going so that was July of 2023 and he drug it I mean I know it’s it was a time consuming process I feel like I don’t know like I want to I want to say the you know maybe the contrary but basically it took long enough to where I didn’t even need the state’s attorney to resentence me because he was going to resentence me and I would have been immediate release and I could have been out okay if not last July I could have been out by August or September October anything would have been better than I guess you know February 9th you know but at the end of the day that’s the day that I got out so it wasn’t like I wasn’t going to hold it against him I’m just like you know it is what it is you know I appreciate you know the offer that you were going to do it you know but um it was just kind of you know one of them things it was just kind of hard to to kind of wrap my mind around it it’s like you know you’re you’re there’s just there’s no hurry you know what I mean it’s like once you get yourself into a situation it can take you know 10 20 years to get it out to get out of it and I’ve met I’ve learned so much from so many other guys that have done so much more time than me and it makes me feel you know like you know like I just kind of I don’t know how you compare it you know I don’t know the right word that I’m looking for like you know my like my time wasn’t nothing compared to some of their time you know where they’ve done 15 or 20 years of their life for for something that doesn’t that’s not violent that doesn’t kill anybody you know so it it it’s just been a it’s it’s it’s been a it’s been a very it’s a blessing like I won’t even say it in a in a negative way it because it’s opened my eyes and my mind to so many different things so many things that I would have never known had I not went through the struggles and the experiences that I went through for certain about the judicial system you know like I always I have knew I had new people that had gone to prison and stuff like that but I had never heard any of the stories that were in detail about like you know you just there’s you can’t explain it you know what I mean when you go into that type of environment yeah it’s it’s insane so you were you were sentenced to like 23 years right yeah and then you were going to have it was like you were going to have to serve like 10 because they were allowing you disturb like some of it like concurrently or okay so Illinois does there’s three different percentages that you can get you can get a 100% for murder like if you any first-degree murder you’re going to serve 100% of your sentence um okay then on the other one is 85% so you’re going to serve 85% of your sentence so if you have 10 years to do 85% % of 10 years is probably eight years and two months or something like that you know what I mean and then my mine was at 50% so when he gave me the 23 it’s automatically cut in half to 11 and a half oh okay you know what I mean so regardless if I would have had to I like I could have done all 11 and a half had I not earned any good time at all right but I literally I had two years in the Cy and then so basically I knocked four years off of of 11 and a half that’s that’s the best way I can basically break it down I did I knocked four years off of 11 and a half which ended up making it to where I ended up doing seven and a half now had I obviously knock had I not knocked those those those four years off I would have done the full 11 and a half well and when you’re when you’re like in prison is someone like explaining this to you or are you like I mean you’re finding this all out on your own so like are there guys in there who are just totally unaware of this stuff oh yeah absolutely yeah yeah they don’t I mean you seem like a smart enough Guy where you would be like looking at the system trying to figure this stuff out it’s like I you know some people in there are probably not the brightest or the best advocate for themselves or they don’t have you know someone trying to figure this out for them at home so that’s upsetting to realize it’s it’s not it’s not calculus like don’t get me wrong like but but how how do you find it out that’s was one of my questions like how are you finding this out who how are you getting the info about legislation like you know I mean okay so really technically like you don’t you are your own resource Source like so if you have like say I call you while I’m incarcerated and I’m like you me and you were good friends you know Cole and I’m like I call you up one day I’m like hey bud I’m like what are you doing I’m like hey can you Google this for me and tell me you know if anything’s changed new bill or something like that you you basically then are my source of information like you can look it up and then when I call you back later you’ll be like hey this is what I’ve kind of figured out now there are certain things like you have counselors you have the counselors in there and stuff and I I’ll tell you most of them counselors don’t give a [ __ ] you know let’s just let’s just call a spade a spade you know uh this this last counselor that I had though um Cole she was she basically was like my night Shining Armor in a sense like she just was super helpful you know with any anything that she could do like like things that I was trying to do when I like for example when I told you I was trying to uh um I was trying to get resentenced but the state’s attorney had requested that I send my master file sheet which my master file is everything that I’ve ever done any any tickets that I’ve ever received in prison any education my work history it’s basically like your resume and I had to request that from Spring Feld well it took them it took Springfield three months to get me back a seven page master file so that I could so that I could send it to the state’s attorney right and then so I sent it to him about October and I’m like man I’m like what is taking so long I’m like it’s just because it’s always that uncertainty hanging and lingering over your head and and so when I sent him that Master file it was just like kind of like okay what are we doing now like I’m just sitting here like just rotting away while you know but I kept like because I don’t like even though Springfield awarded me that year like I wouldn’t even be sitting here talking to you guys right now had I not got that from them you know what I mean so it’s like how can I complain about anything when and you know I’m lucky to have gotten what I got or vice versa even when they changed that bill and gave me the uh the two years that I earned or well when they changed the bill and gave me a whole year for working those jobs in those three years like that’s a whole another two years that I would have had to been sitting there doing you know what I mean had I not gotten that from them so it’s like they’re definitely trying to recidivism you know recidivate the state um and I think partially because of the backlog that they have of cases that are backed up in the county you know what I mean and like literally this isn’t this this little system that they just went that went in effect January 2nd it affected the en entire state so there was thousands of inmates literally that have been that have been getting out these last couple weeks just I mean it’s just Illinois but I don’t know what other states are doing it but you know they’re open are you talking about the the cashless bail thing that’s that’s under the safety act this is under house bill oh I’m have I’d have to look it up and give it to you guys try to Google it but it’s house oh you’re talking about you’re talking about the law that actually that shaved off the time that allowed you to get out yeah exactly okay yeah it’s a house bill I want to say it’s like 3021 or something like that but since January second I would I would love to see the numbers of people that were incarcerated that have got out because I know it’s in the thousands it’s got to be you know I mean because just the prison alone that I was at they were probably shooting anywhere from 10 to 20 people out a week which is a high number at a prison that’s not that’s that’s a that’s a a facility that’s a minimum security facility that offers those type that offers the programs and stuff like that that kicks you out the door because it’s suppos it’s basically supposed to be like a re-entry facility they’re supposed to be there preparing you for that when you get out right and they don’t do that you know um literally it was quite the opposite like I if I didn’t have the support that I did from from a lot of people like I mean even just not even finan like financially definitely but like if I didn’t have the financial support that I have when I got out I mean I would have probably ended up in a halfway house you know where where you’re there and then they want you to find a job and then you get out on your feet stuff like that like that’s a much slower process and unfortunately a lot of guys have to go that route you know what I mean because they don’t have that support system you know I don’t they don’t they might have burnt their Bridges they might have you know what I mean they just but they just shove you out the door and they’re like here you know don’t commit any crimes don’t come back you know basically yeah but this this like law that they passed like the one that helped you get out a lot of the people that are probably getting out are people that have like similar like they were part of that tier of crime where like they only have to serve half their sentence so are a lot of these other are a lot of these other people like potentially like drug crimes like not even just cannabis but like and most of them I mean interesting for the most part um like not so many no violent I can’t really think of anybody that I knew that that I seen get out that was in on a violent case um but most of the guys were guys that had been gone for a while you know what I mean like over five or so years where they had worked the main important thing was the how much had they worked from 2018 to 2021 so if you hadn’t been locked up if you weren’t locked up like say you got locked up 2020 you would have benefited from that one year from 2020 to 21 or you know whatever so but if you had gotten locked up after 2021 that’s when they started giving you the good time so you wouldn’t have had to worry about getting your back getting pro-rated you know something that was owed to you because you weren’t you weren’t there for that when that was going on but yeah it that’s it’s it’s just I’m curious though because it was just so many people you know that were that were getting out in front of me and I’m like man I’m like and you don’t even know because no one’s telling you nothing you’re just waiting one day on a piece of paper to come in the mail and dude that was the like I’ll tell you one thing that like messes with you mentally for sure is the mailing like when you when you receive mail you know from loved ones girlfriends whatever um phone calls and your emails because you you have you have they have an emailing system where you know they proofread and make sure you’re not you know saying anything crazy but the last facility that I was just at they would play with it like there would be day like you wouldn’t like they would shut the phones down you know I mean so then you’re not being able to call and check on your kids and stuff that night they would literally not pass mail out for days like three or four days mail comes every day Monday through Friday you know what I mean so like why are your officers not like sorting through this mail in the mail room every day and making sure that we’re getting our pictures and our letters and stuff like that that our people send us you know like it was just like those are the type of things and then on top of that the last facility that I was just in was a dorm setting so I’m in a room with 28 other guys farting and burping and and talking [ __ ] all you know what I mean like you’re in a you’re in a small room probably maybe two maybe there’s just there’s 14 bunks in one tiny ass room you know so all the bunks are probably a foot apart you know what I mean so you’ve got 28 different guys that you have to interact with every day whether you like it or not you know it’s kind of like if I had to compare anything it’s probably like being kind of in the military without without machine guns you [Laughter] know damn that sucks that literally yeah it and then and it just like I said when they when they play when the when the prison plays with your mail and your phone calls and like little just anything that they can get through to you and try to break you down like even the food like in the cafeteria you know I mean they serve you slop on a trade and you’re looking at it like you know you’re just like I bet you wouldn’t even feed this to your dog you know what I mean and it’s like I get it it’s it’s just you know it’s there for a reason like there are definitely people that do belong there but they need to they need to definitely they need to change the laws on certain things right yeah it’s like there there’s people that belong there but you could still like feed them real food yeah that’s at least like shitty cafeteria food you give elementary school kids or something like that yeah yeah and that that like you know it is crazy to me that and like you say we like I want to give you more space and I’m sure in the future we’ll talk because I doubt this is the last time we chat but like you know you’re there with people that like we just said like there are some people that maybe truly need to to be rehabilitated let’s say but I guess that’s my question do you feel so you’re not really supposed to be there we agree you hear Cole yep I can hear you you still there did I cut out on you nope no I can hear you fine can you hear me yeah I think he did cut out for a second so he might have missed what you were saying gotcha oh he might be rejoining here I’m gonna pause this just for a moment let me ask you real quick Co so I was asking you um you know we’ve established that we agree you should you shouldn’t have been there and and that’s still crazy I want to just say again that you could like that somebody could today still go there and maybe we’ll loop back around to that but I want to just complete my question real quick do you feel that our systems for the people that let’s say should be there for rehabilitation right because there are certainly maybe some people that maybe had a rough start and might just need like some help do you feel that our systems are even equipped to to help those people you know um because that’s like the ultimate idea is like you know let’s give them some help I don’t I don’t think I think they’re they’re lacking in Illinois in a lot of ways um to treat guys with skills you know like any type of like trade like they haven’t they’re still not open up to like the idea of bringing like welding classes um a lot of the a mechanic classes are kind of like hit and miss like you know as far as like then you’ve got your basic construction you’ve got horiculture which I honestly thought about taking while I was in there um you know just because you never know and uh so but yeah they they’re just they’re under it’s like they’re under staffed I guess in a big way you know because Co did mess a lot of stuff up a lot of people quit a lot of like dude like I mean you should see see the the officers that are coming in now into the into the to the system they’re they’re kids straight out of high school bro you know what I mean and like I had a kid like I mean he’s he’s a CEO I mean God forbid that if anything broke out Cole because he wouldn’t have been able to stop [ __ ] you know what I mean yeah he’s like me look like he would have been he would have been traumatized forever like he would probably like put yeah he’ probably quit but like I said like then you got you know these young kids you know talking to you just crazy you know they just wan to they want to show you that they’re not scared of you basically and they know that if you even blink an eye wrong at them they’re going to come they’re going to come in full force you know swap swap team’s gonna show up on you you know that’s so crazy I cannot imagine I don’t think I’m not built for uh I’m not built for that and that’s one of the questions I wanted to ask you like how did you figure that part out how did you figure out like keep your head down but be in you like you’ve said a few things like keep your head down but don’t you know kind of give the impression that they don’t want to [ __ ] around with you um yeah how’d you figure that [ __ ] out it’s funny so my first my first altercation in in the in the county was over a baseball game it was over Cubs and Cardinals game yeah and that was actually the year the Cubs won the World Series right okay but dude called me a [ __ ] right because I’m a Cubs fan and you know Cubs and Cardinal fans have a long history of going at it you know so I’m literally and I’ve only been in the county like I haven’t even been locked up like probably just a little over 30 days and I’m like I come I come out of my cell and I’m like hey I’m like What’s the score of that game and he was like shut the [ __ ] up [ __ ] go back in your cell blah blah blah [ __ ] the [ __ ] Cubs and I just I snapped I lost it like charged at him you know it’s like obviously the [ __ ] word is fighting words in prison you know what I mean and I felt like if I let him get away with it then there’s other people GNA think you know oh this this kid’s a [ __ ] you know we’ll just we’ll just pick on him we’ll take his trays and what ever so it’s like I kind of had to put my guard up and and show all the other guys in the in the block you know that that I’m not the one like you know you and I’m not gonna let nobody pick on or pre on nobody in front of me you know I don’t care how big and bad and how many people you’ve killed or anything like that you know it’s just about respect and there’s not a lot of that in there you know what I mean but I think I always carried myself in a in a manner to where I’m not going to say that I demanded respect but I definitely I don’t know if that’s the right what requested it you know because if I treat you with respect I expect the same in return and that’s all it boils down to and a lot of people don’t know how to communicate you know they don’t know how to use their words they immediately blow up and want to go to fights and like so funny saying that I got in that first fight over that and over some you know some words that really now to me don’t mean nothing I don’t care what you call me you know what I mean you can you know like my my skin is so much thicker than that so it’s like you know now looking back like if I was to re you know if I was to revisit that I would handle it totally differently you know what I mean I would avoid the altercation you know without looking like a [ __ ] or you know whatever you want to call it but it’s just like I was younger then I was 24 at that time you know I’m 32 now so I definitely grew and matured but not everybody has that same capability a lot of people stay stagnant in their in their mental and they don’t they don’t grow while they’re in there if anything they kind of do the opposite and they come out and look for more ways to get intertwined into criminality or whatever it is that they were into before you know it just advances them you know where like I know you’ve probably seen the movie Blow right yeah I mean you have enough Connections in there to where if I wanted to come out with uh a masters in cocaine I probably could of you know like George Young said it best and you know he said I went in with a GED in marijuana and I came out with a [ __ ] master’s degree in cocaine you know like it is what you make it Cole it’s it’s definitely like one of those things like prison is going to be what you make it if you go looking for that trouble you’re going to find it you know what I mean if you want to be a knucklehead and raise confrontation with the the officers that are there they’re gonna they’re going to let you know who’s bigger you know what I mean who’s better and and and I promise you you know in Illinois back in the day it was a lot different where the inmates ran it the the cosos now have they have took it back under control and time isn’t like what it used to be back in the I guess the the ancient days as they say nowadays it’s like these new younger kids coming in and it’s it’s it’s shifting it’s changing the system is definitely changing you know yeah and hopefully I wna I want to definitely help you know open up a platform try to share the awareness of people that are still locked up for cannabis you know what I mean like I’ve just just now starting to get the groove of like kind of the social Med like I I did have Facebook and stuff like that before I got locked up um and I just made small personal comments on there you know like family and friends stuff like that but like now that I see like how the bloggers and the podcasters and the influencers kind of do what they do I do try to like see if that’s something that I’m may be interested in getting into but I definitely regardless no matter what want to try to share knowledge with people that don’t have a clue on you know what I mean the system and what’s going on were were there many other guys like in the same prison you were in that were in there for cannabis dude I don’t think I’ve met anybody else in there for cannabis okay like that’s where that’s where it was such a shock like I think and if I did they were they were obviously on a lot smaller level and they only had like a year maybe or two to do for like something minor but Phil that is crazy that you asked that because now that I’m sitting here thinking about it like I can never specifically remember anybody ever telling me that they were locked up for marijuana and that’s I feel like I feel like I feel like there has to be in the state because that oh for sure the laww only like the law only allowed you to get out if you had like less than 500 grams was your like crime or whatever yeah so I just I just wondered if there were like other guys that you ran into that were in the same position as you no interesting that’s that’s just bizarre you were the only one well and so like one of the other guys that I knew he had he had a cannabis charg but he also had a gun charged with it so like if we’re just saying cannabis only like just having just having the gun yeah yeah because that’s a violent because that becomes like a violent offense right just having the gun y it can make it it can make it um you basically you could uh how do I say this he had the gun but he was he was a prior felon already before so okay he wasn’t even supposed to have the gun on top of the drug so yeah when you throw the two together you just pack it up but that is like Cole Cole has talked about this before it’s like people I think when they hear like they’ll be like oh let’s release nonviolent drug offenders and it’s like okay but the violent drug offender doesn’t mean they were like stabbing someone while they were getting arrested it just means they had a gun a lot most of the time yeah yeah yeah I don’t and I think that’s a law that kind of should change too because I think if you yeah I understand there’s a lot of guns out there I mean almost every what I can’t remember how many people out of 10 Americans have a gun in their household you know but it’s a bunch probably like nine out of every 10 people um but because I do believe in in that amendment I believe that you should be able to protect yourself and the right to bear arms you know like there is a lot of crazy people that are not mentally stable but but I think like if I’m if I’m in a car and I get pulled over and I have a firearm but I wasn’t in the commission of committing any felony or using it on anybody or anything like that I don’t think I should get 10 years in prison I mean I think you know I don’t know it’s it’s kind of one of those things it’s like you could almost compare that to the uh I was going to say the abortion law but I don’t know if that would be quite you know I mean the same thing it’s just it just seems like a way to just [ __ ] people over more yeah yeah exactly Illinois is good at doing that yeah um well you said you wanted to maybe start Media or something like that I can definitely help you with that and you’re always welcome on here um but yeah you know if I can help at all just let me know um but then uh I was just curious was there like a culture in like in an incarceration did you like was there like rumors that traveled I don’t know like I’m just curious or were you just kind of in your own world okay so like in a in a culture like I’m a very cultured person and like I can I can go over here with um Latinos and socialize and and communication and be just fine with versus I can go you know amongst um the white guys or even the black guys I never had a I never had any problem in that area you know because I mean you do you know you find yourself like and I’m I’m one that worked out with everybody like as far as like on the on the pile uh played basketball you know like I was very uh active I guess as far as far as I should say is like as far as people I interacted with I always tried to make sure that people were having a decent day you know what I mean like without it coming off as like you know just you know just like almost worm or whatever but like I like there was like pretty much anytime I walked around or went somewhere like people were always saying what’s up to me you know what I mean like I just it’s that type of energy that you carry you know and not everybody’s like that like you might have a guy sitting over here that doesn’t mess with with Joe blow over here you know what I mean and they just keep their distance and they don’t say nothing but you got me on the other hand who’s cool with both of them you know what I mean so like culture like I mean as far as like I was just who I am like people people still realize that to this day like you know like don’t get me wrong like I haven’t changed Cole as like from the 24 year old but I’m not the same as I was being at 32 you know what I mean like I’m I I’m still the same person that was the one thing that like kept me focused was like okay I don’t want to come in here and let them try to like break my mind or break my spirit and like basically like turn me into this like institutionalized freaking criminal that’s going to come out and be this you know angry like I didn’t I wasn’t that’s not me you know what I mean like you’re not going to take my happiness don’t get me wrong there was a lot of misery like there’s it’s just full of misery especially in the last place that I was just in you know being around that many people after doing four and a half years behind the door and then coming into an environment that’s completely open it’s a it’s a very big shock because you have to readapt to being around not only because you know in the cell you’re just with one person when you’re in that dorm environment you’re like and on the floor that I was on there was 180 people so it’s just a hallway with seven rooms and in each room there’s about 28 people in each room so you could walk down a hallway and it’s almost like sitting in gr Grand Central uh Union Station or something you know it’s just like it’s chaos I mean it’s just like it’s and it and it really does it really can take a toll on your mental you know what I mean because if you’re not mentally strong you can slip away you know like you’re just you’re FOC your focus will go and then you’ll just kind of just drift along you won’t be but yeah definitely it is the culture in there though it is I don’t even know man I don’t even like to say it like it’s it is diverse you know what I mean like it is in a way somehow it’s segreg ated in a sense it’s not as bad as like California Texas Arizona you know what I mean because like in in in some of those States some of those prisons you have to stay with your own you know right Illinois is not really Illinois is not really on that level anymore like they used to be I don’t know and it’s it’s hard to even try to sit here I mean I would have to try to you know talk to somebody that I like you know I’ve got guys that like my my cell one of my old cellmates he did 22 years for cocaine and um and he’s a good dude man like yeah like he’s in the wrong Hustle but you know yeah 22 years is still way too much time exactly bro and I mean no no one’s being forced to buy and do the cocain k no the guy’s just supplying you know yeah because if that’s the case you might as well if you’re gonna give the guy all the time that’s [ __ ] selling it you might as well give the guy that’s [ __ ] buying it just as much time you know well and it’s the same thing with your case it’s like you know you got as much time as people who like manslaughter or like second deegree murder or like rape you know it’s like why are we sending drug offenders for those kind of sentences like they’re not they’re not comparable yeah what let’s let’s say those sells for somebody who really needs it you know yeah real real because really I mean someone who’s in the drug trade like I mean they’re at heart they’re an entrepreneur yeah you you could probably of anyone you can rehabilitate they would probably be one of the better options yeah it’s like uh Jordan Belfor you you just got out I don’t know if if Wolf of Wall Street if you’ve ever seen the movie if not okay good great you’ve seen it um but yeah like somebody like that can be sent to prison and rehabilitated and changed I don’t know what he does nowadays that’s the point of the movie though who knows but anyways he’s probably still pretty wealthy I would almost bet you that oh yeah I think it was didn’t I didn’t I hear on your podcast call that Tommy Chong was the one who told him to write a book yeah so Tommy Chong came on the show they were like they were like impr prison together yeah so Tommy Chong and Jordan belf for were uh I guess cellmates and he was telling Tommy these stories and Tommy was like dude you should like write that stuff down and that’s how he came up with the Wolf of Wall Street dang that’s crazy hey my buddy my buddy actually sent me a picture uh my buddy actually runs rehab it’s a it’s a sober living out in LA and he actually had a picture with Tommy Chong out in front of the cookies dispensary and he sent me he sent me the picture of him he he goes around like he’s he’s a he’s a good friend of mine um one of my best friends dude and he’s been he’s been a big support um his name’s Nick Morgan and uh yeah he’s just he’s been there in my corner you know the whole time but he uh yeah had that picture and then he sent me another picture Mike Tyson I guess Mike Tyson you know got into the marijuana industry now and uh has a farm and stuff and I guess he like went out there to Mike Tyson’s like Ranch and like met him and everything and sent me like he was always sending me these pictures of everything that he was out doing and running around people he was meeting and stuff and I was always just like that’s the only way you have to really kind of keep up you know with like people in your life you know mhm and uh yeah I mean I’ve watched you know my nephews grow up in pictures for the last seven and a half years and that was a big another thing that just was hard to swallow when I got out I’m was like oh my God these kids are so grown like what happened like quit giving a Miracle Grow you know like what’s going on to be fair even when you’re even when you’re like in their daily life or week you know however much you see your relatives when they’re kids they really do grow up very quickly like it’s still jarring like even if you see them the whole time yeah yeah but I can’t imagine like you say just Liv living it through pictures and just really quick to make you laugh Christian just because you said you just heard about Mike Tyson getting into the Cann of his industry this is one of the products he introduced the the Mike Tyson bites this is not a joke they’re ear bites see that oh my God are those Edibles yeah they’re edibles so kind of funny try those yeah but um one of the things I was going to ask you about you know doesn’t but like I always hear that like you know you can get drugs in prison too did you ever hear or encounter that like did you ever like accidentally come in and your Salem mat’s like smoking a cigarette or something like whoa dude what the [ __ ] I mean so God I don’t even know like so the fir one of the first cies that I had brought some bud um in and luckily it didn’t have to like go anywhere you know like that bad you know as far as how he got it in there but dude it was some it was some I hadn’t smoked in like over a month so when he came in you know I told him right off the bat I’m like if you got anything just let me know you know like I don’t want to get you know us get in trouble or whatever and he’s like yeah he’s like I do um so I’m like all right we’ll you know take care of it put it up whatever you know what I mean I was like I wouldn’t do it just right now because you just came in so obviously if if they start smelling it this quick they’re gonna know exactly who had it and who you know what I mean like you just got to be aware like yeah it’s it’s you can get into a lot of [ __ ] that way but um we did smoke like a couple days and we had that whole like gel po like just lit you know what I mean like it was like it was a man it was like Bittersweet though because like I had like I’m sitting here smoking this [ __ ] I’m like this is the [ __ ] that put me in here you know what I mean now now I’m in here smoking this [ __ ] you know like what the [ __ ] like why is the universe [ __ ] with me like this and uh but that’s not the only obviously marijuana is not the only thing they uh they make Hooch we definitely had some uh Christmas EES and New Year’s EES where we had made like wine it’s basically like wine but you just take the you take fruit take apples oranges pineapples whatever and just ferment them and uh cook and put heat on it and it’ll it’ll rot it’ll turn it’ll turn into wine for sure so I mean as far as that though like I mean there was nothing like they there was some uh there’s like this spice [ __ ] going around in Illinois um they they try to compare it to like K2 but it’s not it’s not K2 it’s like some it’s like some under-the-counter like raid [ __ ] that they’re spraying on U like postcards and like sedus and stuff like that and mailing them in and then these guys are just like tearing off like these little pieces of that paper and smoking it and it’s literally making them have like seizures like they’re like in they like turning into like zombies like it’s it’s crazy and and and they’re were sending so much of it hit the system so hard so fast you know like the the officers and the wardens and stuff like that didn’t know how to really prepare for it you know what I mean and there was almost there was at first there was no way that they could even track it I wonder what it I wonder what it actually is that is that spice stuff is like like a synthetic weed right yeah I remember that from like years ago but and this wasn’t the actual Leaf form this was just the spray the chemical that they were spraying these on these sheets of paper and mailing them in you know it it’d be like if you knew the chemical ingredient like say you had a crossword book puzzle like just one that thick right and say that there was two 300 pages of that crossword puzzle or whatever and you sprayed all of those pages and then you sent that book into me it makes it past the check um and then I start basically Distributing it inside the prison where I’m making uh I mean hell they were selling $150 to $250 pieces of ID like the size of your ID like so and I’d basically just have whoever send the money to a cash app and that’s how I would that’s how I would do it I’m not saying me personally but I’m just saying that’s how no that’s how it would be done yeah that’s cool that’s interesting yeah I’ve never heard of that that is interesting yeah and and it’s that same way you know with guys that want to do fan duel you know like I could call my girlfriend like hey bet on the Kansas City Chiefs tonight you know put this money you know what I mean like send the money off my cash app to Fan duel so that I can I’m glad to know the prisoners are getting in on the uh legalized sports betting oh dude I hope I don’t freaking like I hope this doesn’t like make it to like somebody that you know Welly all the all the calls are recorded I mean they know what’s going on right oh yeah yeah abely so yeah yeah yeah they they they pretty much know and it’s just one of them deals it’s just the Beast that they got to deal with there’s nothing really they can do too much about it you know well I’m sure there’s like things that are worth really cracking down on you know that’s probably not one of them I would bet it’s not I will say the uh the um the K2 thing they it was pretty bad I mean guys were they smoking it they’re smoking that [ __ ] all day and it’s just like it’s just like lighters how do you get lighters okay so no lighters but you have um one you have fans and you can take the negatives and the positives and create a spark with that and a lot of times you’ll have a Q-tip and you just put that spark on the Q-tip and it’ll it’ll flame up you know what I mean and I love the I love the like mver uh nature of of people in jail oh dude Ingenuity is is is insane like I I remember watching like a prison documentary like one of those shows they have on TV and it was all about uh how they would communicate by like flushing notes down the toilet system and they would like fish them out like in other parts of the jail it was insane like literally catch them like catch them in the toilet system yeah that’s crazy yeah it’s it’s a world I will say uh Phil and Cole it’s it’s a world of its own like um I just it’s it’s still like one of the deals like did I use my time wisely enough why I was in there because that’s it’s like you’re you’re giving this kind this opportunity but you got to be able to block all the noise and distraction around you out you know cuz and it’s not it it is and it ain’t kind of hard to do like I mean if you just kind of stay to yourself you’re anti-social a lot of people won’t even acknowledge you you know I mean like like Cole said earlier you just kind of you can you can definitely just keep your head down um honestly like I won’t say that anybody can do it like you just you are kind of like one of them deals where like you figure it out pretty quick you don’t have a choice you know what I mean it’s kind of forced upon you like like for instance like if I was to say like if Cole like Cole’s like said earlier he’s like I don’t think I can do it like you don’t even really have the option to not do it you’re forced to do it and just like how you carry yourself on here is probably how you would carry yourself in there and people will give you enough respect off of just how you treat them off of that if that makes sense you know what I mean like um now don’t get me wrong like there is certain prisons that you can end up that it it’s it’s almost like you don’t have a choice you know what I mean it’s either fight or flight I guess is the best way I can say it but yeah you don’t even you don’t even think about it and as crazy as this might sound like even though I had all that time like when I first started out right after I left the county in 2018 all I’m thinking in my mind is like man I’ve got 10 years to do you know what I mean like how am I how am I gonna do this I don’t see the light at the end of the tunnel I didn’t start seeing the light until literally the last year you know what I mean like I that was really because if I wouldn’t had seen all the blessings and life that I’d seen I would still be doing two more three four more years you know what I mean yeah I just want to say again it’s just insane that you were in there just for something that is like completely normal in so many states right now dude and before I forget and I should have said this earlier like I appreciate you being as genuine and as cool as you have been you know with me and my mother like it literally like means the world to know that like people like yourself people like Phil and dude I couldn’t tell you like I just definitely want to give a shout out to last priser project because they once they posted my story and they’ve got a couple I think 100 thousand followers people just started like like shooting me letters you know what I mean like from all over from Texas from Washington from New York like I started getting these letters and people would be like hey man I just want you to know I appreciate you you’re a Pioneer I’m sitting outside this food truck outside the dispensary that I work at you know like just all these like cool little stories like like hey just keep your head up in there just know you’re not alone you know and like having that type of support and people people that actually reach out that actually care makes doing your time so much easier bro so I just want to I want to thank you for being you know the way you’ve been towards me you know what I mean I’m super grateful for that and I appreciate you you know yeah dude absolutely well it’s [ __ ] up I feel like we failed you the system failed you man it’s a time in your life and a time in your family’s life that I mean I don’t mean to dwell on it yeah we can move on you know type of thing but it is I I do feel feel bad and that’s it’s one of the reasons I was excited to talk to you today is like it is just it’s [ __ ] up that we kind of did Rob you of I mean like you said you can make the most of your time while you’re in there but we did Rob you of your time you probably would have chosen to spend it other places I like and I do wish it could have been sooner than I could have been out you know what I mean the one the one blessing um was that I made it out with without losing anyone super close or dear to me yeah because that was a thought that right there Cole was something that kind of haunted me a little bit like you know like you just never know you never know when someone’s gonna go mother grandmother whoever and my grandmother who was 77 years old um still gets around good and stuff but that was kind of the motivation that she had on me was I was like I’ll never live with myself if if I don’t at least make it home in time to like hug her one more time you know and that was obviously you seen that video that I think my mom had shared on Instagram kind of um displaying that you know like once I grabbed a hold of her it was hard for me to let go of her you know I’m like because the biggest worry was that I wouldn’t have been able to do that had I not made it home in time you know so not to be all like mushy on you but it that was that was one of the biggest things things that kind of put me in high speed to try to get here get home as fast as possible to to reunite with my family and I just want to say you know like even though like my case had that other Dark Cloud attached to it you know it was almost like I was on trial for attempted murder on a police officer you know because of my association with some of those those other guys so you know and I don’t have any problems with long enforcement you know I respect them I I could almost guaranteed for certain tell you that you won’t find maybe but one officer that um would have one bad thing to say about me and that’s only because the one that I’m telling you about is somebody that I grew up with that gave me a hard time you know while I was in there and he’s like basically it’s funny because I went to school with this kid and now he’s a he’s a he’s a CO and he wanted to make my life hell in there you know he knew me he was like you know he’s like the first chance I get he’s like I’m gonna smoke your ass you know just the heads up and I was like good to know you know like I’m gonna stay completely out of your way you know I’m sorry for picking on you and bullying you in school back in junior high and [ __ ] but uh that’s not me anymore you know what I mean and he did he did finally he got he wrote a ticket on me and they took my phone calls away for 30 days Cole so for 30 days I couldn’t call nobody on the phone because he wrote a ticket and it stuck and so yeah 30 days I had to and it was right around Thanksgiving dude literally so I couldn’t like he he he knew what he was doing you know what I mean he was playing a mind game with me and I just don’t think that’s how it should be like it’s like I’m already sentenced I’m already punished why do you feel that it’s your job you’re SEC your your job is security your job is to come here and make sure that I don’t try to escape your job is not to try to mentally [ __ ] with me and make my time harder than it already is that’s not how that is set up it’s not how the system works but yet as you know law enforcement likes to abuse their Authority sometimes because they feel that it’s justified in their their way of doing things well that was with like you know like I read I remember reading about your case forever ago and that was what it always seemed to me was like you got made an example of just because these other guys had ended up shooting a cop you know it was like anyone affiliated with it had to get crazy maximum sentence and you know it just it never seemed yeah it just never seemed right so it is it is great to see you out yeah pH I appreciate it man it’s funny your names Phil too because I was literally just up in Chicago with one of my best friends who his name’s philli and we call him Phil and it was it was a great weekend dude like it was the first kind of trip that I’ve kind of took um going up to to the city and um just going to some some great uh restaurants some uh geanos and just man it was it was good it was it was definitely I needed it and you know as soon as I got out I didn’t um like I said you know financially I was okay but I didn’t want to sit around for more than a couple days like I definitely took like four or five days after I got out but soon as I got out I got straight into construction you know like I went straight to work you know and so now that’s what I’m doing I’m basically um doing construction and drywalling and doing stuff like that so it’s not my forever job it was just something to keep me busy keep some cash flow coming in and uh try to figure out you know my next steps in life you know this is a new chapter for me so um it’s all up from here you know hell yeah hell yeah I’m looking forward to like I say continuing to talk and I can already tell that you’ve got like the uh the mind of of an advocate and your mom was the same way like I was I was just expecting to talk about like your case and I think we ended up spending like an hour and 30 minutes bitching about the shortcomings of the Cannabis system in Illinois because she’s just so refined in in all of it [Laughter] so your mom’s really awesome so shout out to her I know she went on a lot of different shows and made a lot of people aware of of what was going on with your case so big time shout out to her she’s awesome shout out shout out to Tina man hell yeah patriarch go follow her on Instagram hell yeah well um like I say Christian um you know anytime holler at me you’ve got uh you know how to get a hold of me and um I would love to have you back on anytime and like I say um you know if you we definitely got to do this again man this has been this has been great this is a cool experience you know I I love sharing you know so you and Phil are awesome dude so anytime you guys want me I’m more than happy to be on here absolutely yeah I could see many more um because like I say just a lot of the things that you talked about I’ll probably watch this back there’s there were so many things you talked about that were so fascinating that I’m sure we could get into in the future and and so much more you know because again one of the things I started with that I think will close with is uh there are still PE and Phil talked about it earlier there are still people that are in prison for this and you can still go to prison for this we talked to you know I’ve had some attorneys on this show they continue to have to defend uh individuals against the state of Illinois there’s like actually a Supreme Court ruling coming out soon I’m just transporting cannabis this is like Jesus Christ how do I get it home I bought it legally how do I get it home right um but that’s like I say a whole other issue the point that I’m trying to close on is that you know this can still happen today and and that is a problem you know absolutely that’s a big problem so well um Phil uh anything anything before we go or Christian you know want to give both you the space before we I’ll just back up your point and bring up that one guy that had his house raid by SWAT over nine plants last year shit’s insane nine yeah they said they found a pipe bomb but I I think it was just some kind of like homemade bong or something I’m [Laughter] sure so many other cases like that though just for for having a plan I mean we had Carol amonson and she just talked about a case in ranol Illinois that I believe I read about um but there are so many others that we read about all the time where it’s just simple possession um or you know cultivation or you know maybe it is a larger amount but can’t help but wonder even time when I say larger amount I say more than like an ounce or what you would buy at the store and that’s not a large amount to me you know because sometimes you go and it’s like when you go to Sam’s Club you buy them bulk um and it’s not that you intend to always drive around with that quantity you might just be on your way home um so anyways I can’t help but wonder when you read about that because I read about it often if that’s just the case if they just got caught at the wrong time and that’s just so unfort forunate that that’s even possible to happen why I don’t understand why we’re using the criminal law because truly who’s being hurt in these cases that’s really like the question here who’s being hurt I mean I guess the dispensaries that are missing out on those profits I don’t know um yeah I think I think and I know it’s it’s you know it’s it’s opinion based but I think the families the families pay for it more of people that get incarcerated because they’re the ones spending their hard-earned money to put money on our accounts and to make sure that we go to commissary to make sure that we have hygiene you know or whatever it is to make sure we have phone time to be able to call them you know like they per they pour their hard-earned money in into US basically because of the mistakes that we made you know that ended up costing them their money and their time and and part of their freedom too you know because you know I couldn’t tell you how many days how many visits that I had from family and friends that you know they come and sat with me in those prisons all day long so that I’m not back in the cells you know hanging out bored just you know looking around like you know then like I said we’ll wrap this up but I am curious um to see the change that is hopefully about to come you know I know the rescheduling is supposed to maybe be happening coming soon um there there is a thing like I I follow the last prisoner project they’ve been a big support they kind of kept me updated on a lot of the laws and states that were changing um wasn’t a whole lot about Illinois at all ever um about them you know changing the legislation about it because it’s just absurd that someone still today could get it caught with enough marijuana and be facing a maximum of 60 years in prison you know what I mean yeah but you know like I said hopefully 2024 going forward we will all witness you know people being released laws being changed and um you know we can just get past it you know what I mean it it’s just time you know what I mean it’s it’s time to you know free those other guys that that are still in there right now and um make a change you know and and like you said I definitely will take you up on um you know helping me just helping me get informed with how the platforms and the social media and stuff like that you know to help Advocate and help people out you know my mom she’s she’s showed me a lot too you know and and yeah I’ll just I’ll be I’ll be open-minded to you know whatever I need to be to try to help other guys out so yeah yeah Phil were you gonna ask something I saw you you were gonna ask something earlier oh I forgot no problem no problem cool well um yeah well I’m looking forward to that um and uh looking forward to many more conversations with you Christian um wishing you all the best and like I said reach out any time if if we can help in any way so um but folks uh I hope you found as much value in this conversation as I did um I learned a lot about our system and so much more but I’ll keep it at that we’ll see you on the next episode of the Cole memo take care everybody
The Cole Memo 
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